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#264235 - 02/14/14 07:13 AM Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS)
CentralGaGal Offline
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Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 219
Loc: Georgia
Someone posted in another forum that the "Si joints fuse naturally with age" suggesting that they are completely fused by age 50. I asked if she could provide the source she found this in but she could not recall and suggested I research it in anatomy & kinesiology books. I've spent hours reading numerous sources but came up empty so decided to turn here hoping someone else had heard of this.

I know that SI (not S1) fusion is one point used to assess the presence of AS and if this is a true fact, wouldn't that question things in the diagnosis of AS? (I know there are several factors considered but since AS often starts in the Lumbar/SI area and can result in fusion, doesn't this question using the SI fusion as a DX - if factual?)

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#264238 - 02/14/14 08:02 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
tntlamb Online
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Registered: 07/19/11
Posts: 1297
Loc: Montana
You will probably find more if you research: synostosis

heres one article: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ca.980020406/abstract

I wouldn't exactly call it "natural" The problem is the word "fusion" we use it, but really has little meaning outside our world. It can refer to many things. Its pretty easy for radiologist to tell the difference between loss of flexion from aging and that of AS.

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#264239 - 02/14/14 08:05 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
CentralGaGal Offline
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I used the word natural as that was how it was presented. I believe the intent was that it's a natural progression of aging without disease or mechanical intervention. I'll check the resource you provided.

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#264240 - 02/14/14 08:07 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
tntlamb Online
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I understand that, I took her context to mean it happens to everyone - It doesen't.

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#264241 - 02/14/14 08:48 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
CentralGaGal Offline
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Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 219
Loc: Georgia
My question originally posed was, "I see that SI joint fusion can be caused by Sacroiliac Joint Syndrome and AS as we know. It there any condition that can cause fusion that is not surgical?"

I believe the actual words she used in response were, "Some Si joints fuse naturally with age, I believe this often happens in men who have a differently shaped pelvis to women,...."

I'm not questioning the validity of her statement just looking for backing as my internet searches results continued to reference AS and I was curious about this process.

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#264242 - 02/14/14 09:08 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
tntlamb Online
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Registered: 07/19/11
Posts: 1297
Loc: Montana
There are many reasons for synostosis of the spine besides AS. Many of the arthritises, wear and tear, bad genes, compression fractures, and goes the list. Anything that causes inflammation including a bad bed will cause synovitis which in time will cause synostosis (Wikipedia has a pretty good article about synostosis) Heres a quick search: https://www.google.com/search?q=synotiis...tis&spell=1

Just remember that SI fusion is just a small part of AS,

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#264243 - 02/14/14 09:29 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
CentralGaGal Offline
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Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 219
Loc: Georgia
Oh I understand that. My worst part actually is in my neck and after breaking my back in 4 places in January from a simple fall, possibly my Thoracic area.

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#264244 - 02/14/14 09:56 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
tntlamb Online
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Registered: 07/19/11
Posts: 1297
Loc: Montana
OMG, I crushed to Vertebrae 20 years ago and they still speak to me.....


I'm having a shoulder replaced in a couple weeks here and the discussion is; was it falling off a motorcycle 30 years ago or disease? Of course the Rheumy says it the bike as she's doing her job, the radiologist says its osteo and the surgeon say its the Osteo the fall, life and all made worse by the disease....

I find myself wondering way too much about the "why" and tend to for get the "what" and just do the things I need to do.

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#264245 - 02/14/14 10:31 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
CentralGaGal Offline
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Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 219
Loc: Georgia
Believe me I understand the "everyone's got their opinion".

I have two doctors (actually three) saying it's AS and a new one time Rheumy that asked if I felt better when resting or being active. My active thought was the extremes of working in the yard, being on my feet too long, or housework so I said probably resting and she immediately said then it's probably not AS....WITHOUT reviewing any of the ME or Radiology reports or notes from other doctors OR films from the hospital stay....she quickly escorted me out, telling me to see the Pain Doctor and it probably was all DDD and osteoarthritis and there was no inflammation so without that, I didn't have it. Totally blew me out of the water.

I don't even know where to go from there but I had two other doctor that reviewed my records and both said I was quite inflamed and the films sure looked like AS to them.

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#264246 - 02/14/14 10:58 AM Re: Natural Fusion of the SI Joint (not by AS) [Re: CentralGaGal]
tntlamb Online
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Registered: 07/19/11
Posts: 1297
Loc: Montana
Unfortunately shes got a point. It should not get better with rest. Now thats not to say that you don't don't have a problem (or AS,) obviously you do. Remember the DISEASE cause's the symptoms the abnormal studies etc, it isn't the symptoms, So you can get similar symtoms from different diseases.

Thats sort of standard question. What you need do before your next appointment is keep really good track of symptoms and when the occur. AS WILL get bad during rest, ifact it will wake you up from a sound sleep when you have had no pain (relativley) all day.

The multiple docs? Is no one willing to treat you if they are saying you have AS???

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